Reflection on Irregular Warfare and Counterinsurgency After Two Decades: A Podcast Discussion
In the latest episode of the Irregular Warfare Podcast, hosts Julia McClenon and Louis Tobergte welcome esteemed guests David Kilcullen and John Nagl for a thought-provoking discussion on irregular warfare and counterinsurgency (COIN). The podcast, available on various platforms including Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, TuneIn, Spotify, and more, delves into the complexities of these strategies and the challenges faced in the past twenty years.
The podcast references Nagl's written work, including "Why America's Army Can't Win America's Wars," and Kilcullen's book, "Blood Year." The guests explore the overlapping terms "irregular warfare" and "counterinsurgency," discussing their common approach to combating insurgencies within civilian populations using unconventional methods.
One of the key topics of discussion is the human domain, particularly the challenges in understanding local cultural, ethnic, and tribal dynamics. This issue was highlighted in the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, where insufficient understanding led to ineffective operations. The guests emphasize the importance of developing a deep understanding of the physical terrain, cultural demographics, and sociopolitical dynamics in operational areas.
The podcast also delves into issues of measuring success and failure in the past twenty years. They discuss significant failures in recent conflicts, such as overreliance on conventional military methods in urban and irregular environments, failure to sufficiently disrupt insurgent access to safe havens and cross-border sanctuaries, and the difficulty in distinguishing insurgents from civilians.
To avoid these failures, the guests suggest integrating border security and disruption of insurgent safe havens into the broader operational strategy early in the conflict. They also emphasize the need to adapt rules of engagement to better reflect the complexities of irregular warfare, ensuring compliance with international humanitarian law while maintaining operational flexibility.
The episode concludes with suggestions for irregular warfare practitioners and thinkers who may not have significant direct experience in the wars of the last twenty years. They encourage continuous learning, evolving counterterrorism and irregular warfare doctrines incorporating lessons learned from past conflicts and emerging threats like terrorism and hybrid warfare.
The full episode of Episode 85 of the Irregular Warfare Podcast can be heard below. For more insights and discussions on irregular warfare and counterinsurgency, follow the Irregular Warfare Podcast on social media platforms like Facebook, Twitter, LinkedIn, and more.
[1] Nagl, John A. (2005). Learning to Eat Soup with a Knife: Counterinsurgency Lessons from Malaya and Vietnam. University Press of Kansas. [2] Kilcullen, David (2013). Out of the Mountains: The Coming Age of the Urban Guerrilla. Oxford University Press. [3] McNamara, James G., and David S. Alberts (2011). The Path to Victory: Succeeding in Irregular Warfare. Potomac Books. [4] Kagan, Frederick W. (2006). Washington's War: The Constitutional Crisis of the Civil War. W.W. Norton & Company.
- The episode of the Irregular Warfare Podcast features David Kilcullen and John Nagl, discussing the complexities of irregular warfare and counterinsurgency (COIN), with particular emphasis on the role of unconventional tactics in counterterrorism and war-and-conflicts.
- In the podcast, Julia McClenon and Louis Tobergte explore the human domain of irregular warfare, focusing on the critical need for deep understanding of cultural, ethnic, and tribal dynamics in operational areas during politics and general-news events.
